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#1 OFFLINE   TheDoubleD

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 12:16 AM

Since I am new here and cannot use the search feature yet, please forgive me for starting a topic that may have been cussed and discussed to death..of course if it hasn't now is as good a time as any to start a discussion.

I picked up a pair of FMK AR polymer lowers--one via the Friends of the NRA Auction and one an out right purchase.

I have a couple parts kits that i going to use to assembles these lowers. One parts kit is a DPMS lower receiver kit and the other is Delton enchanced part kit with two stage trigger.

Does any one have any advice or tips for assembling a polymer receiver.

Are there any special issues with either of these two part kits?


#2 OFFLINE   Sgtar15

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 12:29 AM

Poly lowers have a rather poor reputation for not holding up to well.


#3 OFFLINE   Sgtar15

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 12:32 AM

Here is a 4 page thread about them.

link


#4 OFFLINE   Flesh Wound

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 12:49 AM

Since you have them I guess it's a moot point....

Take your time to assemble them. Be careful. Plastic parts and all. I've got a polymer lower on a dedicated .22LR rifle. I'd not buy another.

So long as you understand these will not be durable you can use them until they are worn out or broken. Then you can get a good alloy lower.


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#5 OFFLINE   oak1971

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 01:06 AM

Yikes. This again. :laugh:


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#6 OFFLINE   TheDoubleD

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 01:08 AM

So what happen when you built your polymer .223?

What's not durable about polymer?

This, and the linked post sounds strangely like the negative opinions passed by folks with no first hand experience and little knowledge of polymers when the Glock came out 23-30 years ago. Now it seems every hand gun manufacture has a polymer frame hand gun. And these guns have have shown the have very long life.



Any one have any first hand experience with these frames on center fire calibers instead of just second had internet lore?

Edited by TheDoubleD, Oct. 19 2012 - 01:11 AM.



#7 OFFLINE   oak1971

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 01:15 AM

If you read that thread linked above you'll see why poly is a poor choice for an AR platform.


#8 ONLINE   Pepper

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 01:16 AM

So what happen when you built your polymer .223?

What's not durable about polymer?

This, and the linked post sounds strangely like the negative opinions passed by folks with no first hand experience and little knowledge of polymers when the Glock came out. Now it seems every hand gun manufacture has a polymer frame hand gun. And these guns have have shown the have very long life.



Any one have any first hand experience with these frames on centerfire calibers instead of just internet lore?

Yes. They're freaking garbage foisted upon the AR community by people who care more about making a buck, than innovation, or honor in the gun culture. I've seen them break, first hand. One of our sponsors decided to try one for himself, and it came apart. They're garbage. Junk. Trash.

I know it sucks to hear that you made a bad purchase, and did so without all the information. If I were in your shoes, I would attempt to return them, even at a slight loss. If I could not, I would attempt to sell them as soon as possible.

I could type several paragraphs about why they're junk, and describe in detail what goes wrong, but really, just read the thread that was linked, and follow the links in that thread. Every so often, we get someone who comes here and asks about the problems with polymer, and we go through the same spiel. Often the owner of the inferior lowers gets upset that we say his new lower is junk, but they really shouldn't. They should chalk it up as a learning experience and move on. Sort of like buying a Taurus, or a Yugo. Everyone is entitled to a mistake or two, and we promise we won't beat you over the head with it.


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#9 OFFLINE   Flesh Wound

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 01:54 AM

Everyone is entitled to a mistake or two, and we promise we won't beat you over the head with it.


Well not too hard anyways... :nt:

I made the mistake of buying a poly lower. I ran it briefly on a 5.56 carbine. Just felt too sloppy and cheap. I was not confident it would hold up. My life might depend on that carbine. I've moved the lower to a dedicated .22LR build. It can stay there as that's a range toy.

If you are happy with your polymer lower than more power to ya. Otherwise there's no reason to get all butt-hurt over it. :sad:

Edited by Flesh Wound, Oct. 19 2012 - 01:54 AM.



#10 OFFLINE   Dark Prophit

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 02:31 AM

Have fun with it, but next time buy a real lower


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#11 OFFLINE   Nwatson99

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 02:36 AM

So what happen when you built your polymer .223?

What's not durable about polymer?

This, and the linked post sounds strangely like the negative opinions passed by folks with no first hand experience and little knowledge of polymers when the Glock came out 23-30 years ago. Now it seems every hand gun manufacture has a polymer frame hand gun. And these guns have have shown the have very long life.



Any one have any first hand experience with these frames on center fire calibers instead of just second had internet lore?

Polymer is weaker than metal period, yes polymer has its' useful applications, but not on a AR15 lower.
The AR15 lower manufactured with Polymer, Carbon, and Composite have all failed, some fail sooner than others that is not folk or internet lore that is the gospel and the way of life.
No one can compare a Glock to a AR15, the only single thing they have in common is they house the some of the lower parts for both, that is all and that is what the huge problem is with the market, everyone thinks because a Glock has been successful everything else should be as well, but that is not even remotely the case.
Read the link given to you above, one of your polymer lowers did not even survive the first range trip before it feel apart, good luck with your lowers though and like FW said you have a lower that if you build 22LR out them they will give you much longer service.


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#12 OFFLINE   rifleman2000

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 08:47 AM

So what happen when you built your polymer .223?

What's not durable about polymer?

This, and the linked post sounds strangely like the negative opinions passed by folks with no first hand experience and little knowledge of polymers when the Glock came out 23-30 years ago. Now it seems every hand gun manufacture has a polymer frame hand gun. And these guns have have shown the have very long life.



Any one have any first hand experience with these frames on center fire calibers instead of just second had internet lore?


Build your rifles. Fire them. Post pictures of the broken rifles so we have someone with "first hand experience".

AR lowers are not Glock pistols. They have different dimensions that are subject to different stresses.


#13 OFFLINE   TheDoubleD

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 09:14 AM

Well not too hard anyways... :nt:

I made the mistake of buying a poly lower. I ran it briefly on a 5.56 carbine. Just felt too sloppy and cheap. I was not confident it would hold up. My life might depend on that carbine. I've moved the lower to a dedicated .22LR build. It can stay there as that's a range toy.

If you are happy with your polymer lower than more power to ya. Otherwise there's no reason to get all butt-hurt over it. :sad:



Thanks Flesh wound I am glad to hear your first hand experience. Am I to understand , that your lower never failed, you just lost confidence in it. Why was that? Because of something that occurred shooting or the internet trash talk.

Do any of the others who posted negative opinions have any real first hand experience with actual failures or are you just repeating what you heard on the net. I have not read one first hand report about these failures. Certainly none of these second hand reports I have read contain any substantive information that these failure were any different than similar failures in alloy versions of this gun.

And just for the record some of the negative arguments expressed about these polymer frames, parrot what was being said about the introduction of the plastic and aluminum Matty Mattel rifle by the wood and steel gun crowd back in the '60's. The only difference is that back then we didn't have the internet to spread the word.


#14 OFFLINE   Dark Prophit

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 09:27 AM

Here ya go:

http://www.ar15armor...6201-poly-guns/

dont perpetuate the myth that poly ar lowers are not junk when they are.




#15 ONLINE   Pepper

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 09:34 AM

Thanks Flesh wound I am glad to hear your first hand experience. Am I to understand , that your lower never failed, you just lost confidence in it. Why was that? Because of something that occurred shooting or the internet trash talk.

Do any of the others who posted negative opinions have any real first hand experience with actual failures or are you just repeating what you heard on the net. I have not read one first hand report about these failures. Certainly none of these second hand reports I have read contain any substantive information that these failure were any different than similar failures in alloy versions of this gun.

And just for the record some of the negative arguments expressed about these polymer frames, parrot what was being said about the introduction of the plastic and aluminum Matty Mattel rifle by the wood and steel gun crowd back in the '60's. The only difference is that back then we didn't have the internet to spread the word.

Did you read this thread and the responses in it? I. Have. First. Hand. Experience. Polymer lowers are garbage.

The difference between a Glock, and a polymer AR15 lower, is the Glock was DESIGNED to be made from polymer. The AR was NOT. Design a rifle system from the ground up that uses a polymer receiver, and is reinforced with metal of some kind in stress areas, and I'll probably buy it. But trying to make an existing design work like the current crop of polymer lowers is a bad idea, and is only done to save the manufacturers money, and to fleece unsuspecting buyers.


#16 OFFLINE   oak1971

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 09:54 AM

I'm going to call it what it is. It's a troll thread.


#17 OFFLINE   rifleman2000

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 11:04 AM

I always got a kick out of this thread.

Link.


#18 OFFLINE   oak1971

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 11:17 AM

http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be


#19 OFFLINE   oak1971

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 11:18 AM

http://www.youtube.c...eature=youtu.be


#20 OFFLINE   Growler67

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Posted Oct. 19 2012 - 03:25 PM

Those making the arguement of: "..what about Glocks, or SCAR's..." andso forth I have to say this. THOSE platforms and others were designed from the outset to be polymer built. The engineering and design incorporated the intended materials it was to be made with. The AR platform was designed to be made from aluminum. Unless and until materials technology )polymers and poly-resins) can exceed those of the aluminum lower AS DESIGNED.....there will remain questions about long term reliability. Perhaps that maybe one reason a lifetime warranty is in need of being issued with these items.....when they fail, they can do research with the returned failed lower and they send you another.....and another....

I am in favor of weight savings, but I remain skeptical of poly lowers and their long term durability.


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