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zollen

Self-Propelled Gas Piston System

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m4sdesign.png

 

Advantages of this piston upgrade kit concept:

 

1. Same level of complexity as the standard AR gas piston system

2. Zero to Minimum modification required for installing this piston system to any standard AR platforms.

3. The installation of a folding stock on a standard AR is now possible.

4. A custom BCG may be provided so owners would not have to saw off the last part of their standard BCG.

Edited by zollen

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So instead of a DI side folding AR you could have a GPU side folder?

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That doesn't seem any different than a normal pistol system.

 

 

For the addition of a folding stock you just as easily cut down the BCG, add an AK style recoil spring and be done with it. Of course it was done nearly 10 years ago by ZK.

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That doesn't seem any different than a normal pistol system.

 

 

For the addition of a folding stock you just as easily cut down the BCG, add an AK style recoil spring and be done with it. Of course it was done nearly 10 years ago by ZK.

 

You are correct. I basically rearrange the buffer tube to the front and use two smaller buffer tubes so they can be fitted in a handguard/rail system.

Edited by zollen

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That doesn't seem any different than a normal pistol system.

 

 

For the addition of a folding stock you just as easily cut down the BCG, add an AK style recoil spring and be done with it. Of course it was done nearly 10 years ago by ZK.

 

How was that modification worked? Where would they put the AK style spring?

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So instead of a DI side folding AR you could have a GPU side folder?

 

Yes.

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How was that modification worked? Where would they put the AK style spring?

 

Not a piston

The gas tube and gas key are one long unit that fits to a short tube at the gas block

The enlongated gas key has a recoil spring on its exterior that returns the bolt

The bolt still functions/unlocks when gas enters the BCG causing it to unlock just like a DI AR15

The carrier only houses the fireing pin and bolt, basicly the back half of it is removed just behind the fireing pin

 

LR300_Gas1.jpg

Gas key

IMG_0636.jpg

Bolt

IMG_0644.jpg

Bas tube

IMG_0641.jpg

 

 

EDIT: Just pasted it all in.

Edited by dave2184

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Thanks. It is not exactly a standard AR. It looks like a specialize designed upper receiver.

 

Not a piston

The gas tube and gas key are one long unit that fits to a short tube at the gas block

The enlongated gas key has a recoil spring on its exterior that returns the bolt

The bolt still functions/unlocks when gas enters the BCG causing it to unlock just like a DI AR15

The carrier only houses the fireing pin and bolt, basicly the back half of it is removed just behind the fireing pin

 

LR300_Gas1.jpg

Gas key

IMG_0636.jpg

Bolt

IMG_0644.jpg

Bas tube

IMG_0641.jpg

 

 

EDIT: Just pasted it all in.

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Thanks. It is not exactly a standard AR. It looks like a specialize designed upper receiver.

 

Yup they've always had a proprietary upper. The first models ZM made in house.

http://www.enemyforces.net/firearms/lr300.htm

 

The newer ones posted in the pics above are made by PARA USA.

http://www.para-usa.com/new/product_rifle.php

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My concept was a piston upgrade kit for standard AR. This kit also eliminate the need of having a rear buffer tube.

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My concept was a piston upgrade kit for standard AR. This kit also eliminate the need of having a rear buffer tube.

 

Can you on any level execute and build any of your designs? Do you have experience designing firearms?

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Nice copy of an existing system.

 

It's simply an extended gas key DI. The piston that DI uses is still the back of the bolt. Nothing makes DI non piston, it has one. It's just not recognized by DI haters. Facts are too confusing for them.

 

Yes, you can cut down the bolt. It's a concept I've considered for a simple bolt gun, no gas at all. Cutting it down does require adding the same weight mass back to get into the operating envelope of the cyclic action. That can be done with the gas key. It does need consideration that the key is now reciprocatiing in the front handguard and ANY debris could block or jam the action. Open format CNC quad rails won't protect it, it needs a closed shield - which will prevent exhausting the heat.

 

Oh bother, said Pooh. Everything has an offset.

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Nice copy of an existing system.

 

It's simply an extended gas key DI. The piston that DI uses is still the back of the bolt. Nothing makes DI non piston, it has one. It's just not recognized by DI haters. Facts are too confusing for them.

 

Yes, you can cut down the bolt. It's a concept I've considered for a simple bolt gun, no gas at all. Cutting it down does require adding the same weight mass back to get into the operating envelope of the cyclic action. That can be done with the gas key. It does need consideration that the key is now reciprocatiing in the front handguard and ANY debris could block or jam the action. Open format CNC quad rails won't protect it, it needs a closed shield - which will prevent exhausting the heat.

 

Oh bother, said Pooh. Everything has an offset.

 

The front double buffer tubes are protected by the sealed composite buffer tube casing. This casings are very lightweight and have very low heat conductivity.

 

All I have done is to rearrange the rear buffer tube to the front. The front buffet tubes have half the diameter of any standard buffer tube in order to be fit inside a standard handgaurd/rail system.

 

When the piston get pushed back by the hot gas, it also compress the front buffer tubes simultaneously.

 

The carrier key cup secures the carrier key tightly in place so that the piston rod could push/pull the BCG. Because The carrier key cup tightly secures the carrier key, it may also solved the issue of carrier tilt.

 

 

This upgrade kit would also provide a custom shorter version of BCG so owners would not have to saw off the excess part of their standard bolt.

Edited by zollen

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Please don't take this the wrong way, BUT...

 

I admire your abstract and innovative outlook on these sorts of things, but the designs introduce too many "what if" factors and "fix" a problem that doesn't exst to begin with, while adding an extra negative side effect or two. In this case, extra weight aft the magwell (center of gravity on most M4's with a loaded mag), and less weight behind it (sans buffer/spring etc.). This yeilds a front heavy rifle, which is no fun to shoot for long periods of time.

 

Another thing- what about buffer weights? Spring weights? Both of which would need to be T&E "Beta tested" extensively to find what combination works best with certain loads, which would drive the cost up quite a bit, considering these would definately be one off or special ordered parts.

 

What about heat? Having the buffers so close to the barrel would undoubtedly not only keep the barrel from cooling sufficiently, but the buffer tubes themselves would become extremely hot, possibly drying out whatever lube you use in them (though automotive bearing grease would probably work wonderfully).

 

Again, I truly admire your vision, because most of your ideas are truly unique. I just think you need to take it to the drawing board a bit more extensively. I think you'd be greatly beneficial to the firearms industry man, I really do! Honestly though, I think you should start from scratch by designing your own platform. Who knows- you may be the next John Browning!

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you have a bad habit of overthinking and overcomplicating shat, improvements do not make a system more complicated or prone to new issues, they either remove existing issues, lighten weight, or provide a solution to a neccessity, none of yours have done any of those

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