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Remember the botched no-knock raid in Houston?


Flesh Wound
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I'm going to start this by saying that if those officers lied, or are corrupt, that they need to be taken out behind the jail and shot, not imprisoned. Betraying the public's trust to gain a conviction is tantamount to premeditated murder, even if no one was physically injured. That two people are dead because of their lies? Off with their heads. BUT...

 

Reading the article, it's kind of obvious the slant things are taking. It is absolutely an opinion piece, and a hit piece at that. Report the facts, let the speculation happen in the reader's mind. Report that there was a stolen gun in his car, not speculate that it may have been taken from a no-knock warrant. If he had a history of abusing no-knock warrants, make a case for that by stating simply that he stated there were guns in the home and none were ever listed as recovered. Add in that there were drugs found in his car, and list what explanation was offered, if any. Mishandling evidence is going to result in disciplinary action, and in defendants going free. Deliberate actions to conceal or steal evidence are going to result in criminal charges and loss of careers. 

 

I'd much rather read an unbiased account of the incident, and read the reports prepared by investigators instead of third or fourth hand interpretations of those reports, then spun to include the author's opinion in an article designed for a specific audience, and intended to spark outrage and anger. 

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6 hours ago, Pepper said:

I'm going to start this by saying that if those officers lied, or are corrupt, that they need to be taken out behind the jail and shot, not imprisoned. Betraying the public's trust to gain a conviction is tantamount to premeditated murder, even if no one was physically injured. That two people are dead because of their lies? Off with their heads. BUT...

 

Reading the article, it's kind of obvious the slant things are taking. It is absolutely an opinion piece, and a hit piece at that. Report the facts, let the speculation happen in the reader's mind. Report that there was a stolen gun in his car, not speculate that it may have been taken from a no-knock warrant. If he had a history of abusing no-knock warrants, make a case for that by stating simply that he stated there were guns in the home and none were ever listed as recovered. Add in that there were drugs found in his car, and list what explanation was offered, if any. Mishandling evidence is going to result in disciplinary action, and in defendants going free. Deliberate actions to conceal or steal evidence are going to result in criminal charges and loss of careers. 

 

I'd much rather read an unbiased account of the incident, and read the reports prepared by investigators instead of third or fourth hand interpretations of those reports, then spun to include the author's opinion in an article designed for a specific audience, and intended to spark outrage and anger. 

 

100% what you said.

 

I put the obvious bias away reading that story. The take-away for me was the bits of testimony from the FBI investigator. These two appear dirty as hell. I said this stunk somehow right from the git-go when this raid made the news.

 

As I've been following this as best as I can the whole thing is rotten. These two officers set up this raid on innocent people and now both are dead and 4 cops got shot in the process. One cannot help but expect these guys were just as dirty on previous raids. But, I do see your point and agree. Somebody has a shitload of esplaining to do.

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Criminals which badges are simply vermin., and they should be exterminated in much the same way  after they are found guilty in a Court of Law.  

Scum like these two make the job of policing that much harder, undo a lot of the good the vast 99% of cops do everyday, and they steal our honor.

It is human nature to remember the bad that happens, and not so much the good.  Scum like these hurt every single cop in America, and make us left safe. 

The MSM devotes much time and energy to these type of stories for two reasons. One is that such crimes like that are very rare, and two because the police are not exactly the favorites of the Leftist media.  

 

My understanding is that qualified applicants for Peace Officers are becoming few and f between . The BLM movement and Obama's cheerleading for Americans to believe that white cops in specific had an agenda to shoot young black men who did not deserve shooting should be considered guilty until proven innocent sure stoked fires.   The whole thing is still surreal to me and many LEO's. The size and power of Obama's and the Leftist's false narratives is not to be underestimated.

 

I believe I have made it clear what I think about these two alleged scumbags once they have been convicted. I have also not denied that there are corrupt and otherwise bad cops out there. All I am asking it to not take the rare allegations and turn them against Peace Officer as a group

John 

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11 hours ago, Pepper said:

I'm going to start this by saying that if those officers lied, or are corrupt, that they need to be taken out behind the jail and shot, not imprisoned. Betraying the public's trust to gain a conviction is tantamount to premeditated murder, even if no one was physically injured. That two people are dead because of their lies? Off with their heads. BUT...

 

Reading the article, it's kind of obvious the slant things are taking. It is absolutely an opinion piece, and a hit piece at that. Report the facts, let the speculation happen in the reader's mind. Report that there was a stolen gun in his car, not speculate that it may have been taken from a no-knock warrant. If he had a history of abusing no-knock warrants, make a case for that by stating simply that he stated there were guns in the home and none were ever listed as recovered. Add in that there were drugs found in his car, and list what explanation was offered, if any. Mishandling evidence is going to result in disciplinary action, and in defendants going free. Deliberate actions to conceal or steal evidence are going to result in criminal charges and loss of careers. 

I'd much rather read an unbiased account of the incident, and read the reports prepared by investigators instead of third or fourth hand interpretations of those reports, then spun to include the author's opinion in an article designed for a specific audience, and intended to spark outrage and anger.

 

I’m with you 100% Pepper, I’m sure we all are, but the facts, unfortunately, don’t sell papers.  Sensationalism does.  People today aren’t smart enough to realize what they’re reading is speculation.  They read it on the internet from a reliable news source, so it must be true, right?  

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16 hours ago, Retcop said:

Criminals which badges are simply vermin., and they should be exterminated in much the same way  after they are found guilty in a Court of Law.  

Scum like these two make the job of policing that much harder, undo a lot of the good the vast 99% of cops do everyday, and they steal our honor.

It is human nature to remember the bad that happens, and not so much the good.  Scum like these hurt every single cop in America, and make us left safe. 

The MSM devotes much time and energy to these type of stories for two reasons. One is that such crimes like that are very rare, and two because the police are not exactly the favorites of the Leftist media.  

 

My understanding is that qualified applicants for Peace Officers are becoming few and f between . The BLM movement and Obama's cheerleading for Americans to believe that white cops in specific had an agenda to shoot young black men who did not deserve shooting should be considered guilty until proven innocent sure stoked fires.   The whole thing is still surreal to me and many LEO's. The size and power of Obama's and the Leftist's false narratives is not to be underestimated.

 

I believe I have made it clear what I think about these two alleged scumbags once they have been convicted. I have also not denied that there are corrupt and otherwise bad cops out there. All I am asking it to not take the rare allegations and turn them against Peace Officer as a group

John 

It's actually becoming a real chore to find good, qualified people to be cops. We've had a couple of vacancies for about a year and a half. We've attempted to hire about 6 people in that time, with zero success. We now have another open position, and two candidates that seem like they might get a job offer. Now if they just pass a background investigation.... it seems that other agencies are able to move faster in a hiring process than we are, and if we get a good applicant, by the time we're able to give them a conditional offer, they've gotten one somewhere else. We're at 2008 staffing levels, and our city has nearly doubled in size since then. When I got hired a dozen years ago, there were 150-200 applicants for every position, and most of them were qualified and HUNGRY for the job. Police agencies had their pick of applicants. These days we're lucky if we see 100 applications, let alone 50 that meet the minimum qualifications on paper. Out of those, if we have 10 worth showing up to oral boards, we're lucky, and if we get 2-3 that aren't complete ass bags, then we're ecstatic. The current political climate, war on cops, all of that has a chilling effect on hiring. It's going to get worse before it gets better. 

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7 hours ago, Pepper said:

It's actually becoming a real chore to find good, qualified people to be cops. We've had a couple of vacancies for about a year and a half. We've attempted to hire about 6 people in that time, with zero success. We now have another open position, and two candidates that seem like they might get a job offer. Now if they just pass a background investigation.... it seems that other agencies are able to move faster in a hiring process than we are, and if we get a good applicant, by the time we're able to give them a conditional offer, they've gotten one somewhere else. We're at 2008 staffing levels, and our city has nearly doubled in size since then. When I got hired a dozen years ago, there were 150-200 applicants for every position, and most of them were qualified and HUNGRY for the job. Police agencies had their pick of applicants. These days we're lucky if we see 100 applications, let alone 50 that meet the minimum qualifications on paper. Out of those, if we have 10 worth showing up to oral boards, we're lucky, and if we get 2-3 that aren't complete ass bags, then we're ecstatic. The current political climate, war on cops, all of that has a chilling effect on hiring. It's going to get worse before it gets better. 

 

Spot on Pepper. 

Two things I'd like to add. 

We went through a staff shortage for a relatively short time. We were running a second watch, which is the busiest of the day, with 3 cops and a Supervisor, when we were supposed to have 5 cops. The time before 3rd watch came on and 10:00pm was a real hoot. My town was growing too, and 3rd watch was understaffed also. For people who don't realize, prolonged periods of short staffing not only cause stress, burnout, and greater danger for the cops, it causes the community extra money for overtime when someone is sick or allowed to take leave, since someone has to be called in for overtime. Our shortage was not just from a reduction in applicants, but also because of a change in Chiefs. Once the new Chief got in the hirings recommenced, but there's a long lead time before they are ready to fly solo. We also had the luxury of a fully staffed University PD. This "real" PD had its origins in the riots of 1970, when the Black Panthers came to town and started organizing the burning down of buildings and assaults on cops. 

 

The other thing I'd like to reinforce is that cops do know there is a war being waged against them. We don't have thin skin, and we go into this job with our eyes wide open and not being liked. But what is going on today is so far beyond the pale, it is affecting job performance and actual tactics.who 

No one wants to pursue a career when one of the largest factors is the amount of abuse you will have to take on a daily basis, and danger to life and limb is no longer about "cops and robbers" , but made much worse by being part of a deranged political agenda.  Please think about that for a minute. 

This job is hard enough to do well in and of itself, without feeling like the community you are policing is against you. People need not to blow this off, and realize it is affecting the quality of the policing they are receiving, and the health and safety of their Officers. It really does make for a heavy heart when I see what has happened to policing in this country. I understand it is just one piece of the puzzle of many things that are not right in our times, but it is an important one.

 

It would be my hope that people take the time to watch their City council or County Board Meeting schedules, grab some friends and family, and head to the meetings that have Police Issues on the schedule. You can go out for a pizza afterwards, and have a good time.  Make your voices heard. All politics is local. It takes only a small group of people passing the word that one of their City councilmen or County Board Members is anti-police, and/or wanting to spend your tax money on dumb stuff rather then more cops, more training, and better equipment for their Peace Officers. A special note for very small towns. Many of them try and get by hiring part time officers who receive no benefits, and are already fatigued from working their regular jobs.  many of these cops are first rate, but some are not the cream of the crop, and have hobbled a career together out of multiple part time positions. Demand that your community hire full time cops, and vett and train them properly. Many of the incidents I read about seem to include part time officers or the extra help of part time "constables" to fill in the gaps of a properly trained, organized, and supervised police department. If your town is big enough to need its own municipal cops, it is big enough to do the job the right way.  It's not going to change unless the community gets involved. 

 

BTW: Allow me to throw a bit of raw IIA self interest into the mix. Are the Peace Officers who put their lives on the line for the community going to be more or less likely to cooperate with unconstitutional anti-gun mandates if they believe they have the strong support of the community, or if they believe their community is one where at its best doesn't really care, or at the worst allows demonstrations calling for "dead pigs" that receives just about zero pushback from the law abiding citizens of the community  ? 

This giving support to Police should be a priority of the gun culture, and a relationship that should be established and carefully nurtured so their is no question in the Peace Officer's minds that a large part of their community is going to support them when it does come down to disobeying unlawful orders. I could go deep into the benefits of cultivating such relationships, but I'll be lucky if people have read this far.  Concentrate on your community, but don't forget the big picture when considering how your Police are being affected by State and National politics.  It's up to the gun culture to reach out for that handshake with their Police, and you might be surprised how warmly it is received, and how many Police take their Oaths to the Constitution very seriously.  It's only common sense that these relationships will begin to evaporate in communities and in a culture where the Police rightfully believe it is "us against them"  because the "silent majority"  remains mostly silent when the culture and the community paint the Police as pieces of shite that should be assasinated for the good of the new socialist utopia.

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  • 1 month later...

They lied. No if and or buts about it. 
 

 Staffing is ridiculous nowadays. Quality is even worse. We filled most of a civic center when I took the civil service exam. We get barely enough to send to the academy nowadays. Then most of them don’t make it. The quality of training has gone down due to the quality of FTOs. The mid teens have created a ripple effect that won’t be fixed for decades. If ever. 

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